Page 6 - Luce 2020

T he I nterview

remote locations in places like Chad,
Dafur, Syria and Jordan, Afghanistan,
Kazakhstan or Ingushetia, just to name
a few.

I saw a lot of the worst and best of
humanity over my time with the
organisation.

SR It would not be easy seeing
what, I imagine, was terrible human
deprivation. How did you cope?

EF Well, you’re right in the sense that
one is confronted by a lot of very sad
and depressing situations. But it is also Visiting Burmese refugee families
very uplifting to witness how people to observe that a number of initiatives I outcome and I chose to promote direct
are able to rise above it and manage to pursued did serve to enhance UNHCR’s engagement by the University on the
retain their dignity and generosity of authority as the pre-eminent protection statelessness issue. The then Dean of the
spirit despite great deprivation. I know it voice in the UN system. Law faculty, Carolyn Evans and Professor
may sound a bit corny, but it was a great Michelle Foster were very supportive
privilege to work for UNHCR. Working One I would particularly mention and the outcome of our combined
for people in this way, being exposed was the 2002 Global Consultations efforts was the creation within the Law
to how people deal with extraordinarily on International Protection, which I School of the Peter McMullin Centre on
difficult circumstances and being instigated and oversaw. These helped Statelessness. Peter and Ruth McMullin
enabled to make even a small difference to modernise understandings of basic were very generous in their financial
to their situation, makes for an extremely refugee law principles, to bolster support of the Centre, such that it is now
rewarding job. up State support to their proper on a very solid monetary footing and
implementation and to set in place a is rapidly establishing a name for itself
SR In 2006 when you were appointed forward-looking ‘Agenda for Protection’ here, but also internationally. I believe
Assistant High Commissioner for in the form of a roadmap for states in it is the only such University-based
Protection for the UNHCR, it made you their dealings with refugees. Statelessness Centre in the world.
the highest ranked Australian working
in the United Nations at that time. Another success of which I am proud SR Our Australian government’s
links to the second arm of UNHCR’s current policy on refugees and border
EF The position carried with it the mandate, its responsibilities for stateless protection is in the media all the time
rank of Assistant Secretary General. people, that is people who have no and is a source of intense debate.
As a political and policy position, State prepared to recognise them as its How would you characterise the
above the bureaucracy if you like, the citizens. When I joined UNHCR this current situation? Are we meeting our
appointment came directly from the was a very under-explored mandate. international obligations?
Secretary General and its holder, even States were wary about too much
while located in UNHCR working on interference in what they regarded as EF I would characterise it as
refugee issues, was considered part of a sovereignty issue and UNHCR was unacceptable. I have said this often: I
the UN Secretary General’s broader essentially confined to an advisory role understand why States need to police
management team. Hence the rank. on citizenship laws. I was determined their borders; I understand why States
There were, of course, other Australians that UNHCR should become more need to put in place controls which
working in senior positions with the UN proactive when it came to the protection allow them to know who is entering the
but it was a time when there were no of people without a citizenship, country and why, and give civil society
Australians occupying a rank higher than getting involved in major situations of a sense of security that criminals are not
this one. statelessness just as it was with refugee being admitted. But there is quite a leap
situations. I obviously was not alone in from legitimate, responsive migration
SR When you reflect on a remarkable this effort but I do believe my advocacy controls to punitive measures designed
career, what stands out for you as key and persistence here made quite a as a deterrent to specific groups wanting
or especially meaningful achievements? contribution to UNHCR ‘rediscovering’ to come, and implemented in a way that
A legacy perhaps? this mandate and having it accepted is inconsistent with international norms
internationally, which is the case today. Australia has long signed onto.
EF I certainly had an influence, I believe,
on the way protection came to be SR Your father would have been Australia is a party to the 1951 Refugee
defined and pursued by UNHCR – and impressed! Convention. This means, not least,
this is important as protection is at the that it has agreed that persons seeking
heart of the mandate of the organisation. EF Maybe this was at the back of my refugee protection, if their claims merit
The protection mandate was anyway mind. When I was offered the Vice- it, deserve that protection, including
evolving, moving on from advocacy, Chancellor’s Fellowship position here at in Australia. Their method of trying to
training and teaching to also embrace Melbourne University, I was determined get here to make their claim is not a
operational interventions. I think it’s fair to leave something behind as an factor which should determine whether

6 LUCE Number 18 2019